[Osx-nutters] The separation of church and state.

[Stefano Mori]

On 2007-Dec-04, at 18:29, Matt Johnston wrote:

>> Hoyle compared the random emergence of even the simplest cell to  
>> the likelihood that "a tornado sweeping through a junk-yard might  
>> assemble a Boeing 747 from the materials therein." Hoyle also  
>> compared the chance of obtaining even a single functioning protein  
>> by chance combination of amino acids to a solar system full of  
>> blind men solving Rubik's Cube simultaneously.[1]
>
> Okay, yes, the chances are infintesmally small. But we have an  
> awfully long time, an awful lot of materials, an awful lot of space  
> and once you have one autopoietic molecule, then you've got a  
> bazillion.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autopoiesis
>
> Remember, this is equivalent to saying you need to roll a MILLION  
> sixes on 6 sided dice. With a MILLION six sided dice it's ALMOST  
> impossible but not ACTUALLY impossible. Luckily we have a UK billion  
> of them.


Aha, yes, so while Hoyle is scratching his head over how chemical  
processes alone could build complex life, what he doesn't see is that  
once some form of simple life accidentally appears, one of it's  
properties is indeed this "self-winding-up", and from there that life  
will continue to develop.

However, is autopoiesis alone enough to explain the subsequent leaps  
in evolution?

Can it, or do you have to go as far as Ervin László and start talking  
about information fields? [1]

Stefano


[1] I have nothing against "fields", even if they sound spooky.  
Frankly the IDists are barking up the wrong tree if they think they  
need to say that life couldn't just evolve, for them to have "proof"  
of God. Strawberry ice cream is "proof" of God. Likewise a speck of  
dust or a methane cloud.





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